As I looked up and down the roster of everyone who ever graced the ring in either the WWE and WCW and could not find anyone who ever came close to changing the narrative of what a professional wrestler was more often and on a more seismic shift than Diamond Dallas Page.  In fact, I will go a step further and say nobody even comes close.

A common thread in athletics is that once you hit your mid-30’s you have likely hit you peak in your field of endeavour.  This is not always the case, as some have postponed their decline a few years, but that is about it.   Athletes make their professional debut in their very early twenties on average, but to do that at the age of 35?  Not only does that seem unlikely, it seems impossible; or at least it did until Diamond Dallas Page decided that this was an unspoken rule that was made to be broken.

Mixed Martial Arts Legend.  Former WWE Superstar.  UFC Hall of Famer.  The World’s Most Dangerous Man.  The Godfather of MMA. 

All of the above have all been phrases attributed to Ken Shamrock, a former champion in virtually every promotion he competed for.  Anyone who saw Shamrock compete either in shoot promotions like the UFC, Pride or Pancrase or in worked organizations like the WWE and TNA, where he was the upstart promotion’s first Heavyweight Champion, could not help but me impressed with his intensity and ability to strike fear in opponents and fans alike with his mere presence.

As much as those phrases all describe Shamrock admirably, I found myself thinking of a different series of adjectives while I was talking to the former multi-time champion.  Innovator, businessman, mentor, historian all were coming to mind.  Perhaps the most accurate word might be reflective, as Ken Shamrock, at 48 years old, though still looking like he could enter the octagon, has ended the stage in his life where he made his name with his fighting prowess, and now uses his intellect to guide his path, and history to understand his past, and that of the sport he helped to make famous.[i]

The UFC has evolved into a multi-million dollar empire, and as athletic entities grow, the pioneers who were there at the beginning generally see their legend grow.[ii]  As a still relatively young man, and living in the digital age, it is easy to fans to watch the early matches of Shamrock and see the early stars of the sport and understand the evolution of a product that for many has replaced Boxing as the premier combat sport in North America.  For many fans, Shamrock symbolizes when Mixed Martial Arts began, although if you ask Ken himself, he might give you a different view.

The labels he has been given might flatter Shamrock, but in our conversation, he is looking towards putting the correct historical perspective of his career, and the sport of Mixed Martial Arts as a whole. 

With UFC dominating the current Mixed Martial Arts narrative, there is a common belief that it all began with that promotion, but modern history tells a different tale.  Tough man contests had long been contested across the United States and there have been examples in the past fifty years of combining multiple disciplines in competitive contests.

Still, as much as traditional Greco Roman Amateur Wresting was a featured attraction in the Olympic Games since its inception, it never translated into huge dollars, thus the belief that a legitimate wrestling match would be too “boring” to draw money, and for a long time in the United States that was true.  In Japan, however it was a completely different story.

In 1975, Muhammad Ali, the Heavyweight Champion of the World in Boxing took place in a “Boxer Vs Wrestler” match against Antonio Inoki, a legend in the world of Japanese Pro Wrestling.[iii]  The match itself was considered a dull affair, with Inoki lying on his back for most of the match kicking the legs of Ali.  The match, which was shown on closed circuit television, told many what they thought they already knew, that hybrid types of fighting wouldn’t work; though in Japan, the intrigue of these type of matches never went away.

Shamrock, whose first ambition was to be a Professional Wrestler, found his way to Japan, and was working for a company called Pro Wrestling Fujiwara Gumi, an offshoot of the UWF promotion in Japan that employed a more realistic shoot style.[iv]  The wrestling showcased by the new organization was still a work, however on a card at the Tokyo Dome on October 4, 1992 they would elect to have Shamrock would compete in a legitimate contest against a man named Don Nakaya Nielson, who was the World Kickboxing Champion at the time.  The match only lasted a minute, when Shamrock tapped out Nielson in an armlock, but something very interesting occurred; the normally stoic Japanese crowd was into what they saw.

Almost instantly, along with Japanese wrestlers, Minoru Suzuki and Masakatsu Funaki, Ken Shamrock helped to form Pancrase, an organization designed promote all fighting disciplines within one sport.  During its inception, Pancrase proved to be successful and Shamrock would become the first “King of Pancrase” in a tournament in 1994.  More importantly, Pancrase shows were filling large size venues and proved that that there was money to be made for a new style of combat sports.

Meanwhile in the United States, Professional Wrestling, while still popular had seen its largest organization, the World Wrestling Federation, openly went to State Athletic Commissions expressing that their matches were predetermined to avoid paying them.  Wrestlers evolved into “Sports Entertainers”, and those who still clung to the belief that Pro Wrestling may have been on the level were told the exact opposite by the product itself.[v]

Boxing began its wane in popularity in the U.S. as constant corruption and the lack of globally recognized champions caused its fan base to slowly deteriorate, a trend that continues to this day.[vi]  Fans of combat sports needed a void, something that felt real, they were ready for the UFC.

For all intents and purposes, the UFC was the first major Mixed Martial Arts organization in the U.S., and almost immediately sports fans started to pay attention, and much like Shamrock had in Japan, he would become a champion again and generate fans.  In the mid-90’s however, the UFC was facing financial issues due to successful lobbying to remove it from Pay per view.[vii]  Shamrock, regarded by many as the biggest name in the sport, looked to capitalize on that with his first love, Professional Wrestling.

As a former Professional Wrestler, Shamrock did not have to make an adjustment to a worked style.  Joining the World Wrestling Federation in 1997, Shamrock would make is eagerly anticipated in-ring debut against former WCW World Heavyweight Champion Vader, which saw Shamrock win in stiff and compelling fashion.[viii]  Shortly after, the company embarked on what would be known as the “Attitude Era” where sexual innuendo ran rampant and pushing the envelope was encouraged.  Although Shamrock did not participate in multiple risqué angles, he raised the bar in a different way, in the ring.

Subtly, the product changed.  Following Shamrock’s lead, submissions were now rendered by tapping out.  Other wrestlers would slowly adopt more realistic like submission moves as their finishers.  Shamrock, who was known for his unparalleled intensity was rubbing off on others, and though the WWE does not often reference Shamrock, much of his influence can still be felt today, especially as they are entering what they call the “Reality Era” where television matches have been much longer and a higher premium is being placed on genuine athleticism and in ring ability; an era that Shamrock paved the way for.

 In my conversation with Ken, we talked about he was justifiably one of the first members of the UFC Hall of Fame, and how he would like to see that institution, or a Mixed Martial Arts Hall of Fame look in the future.  We also had a chance to discuss his legacy in Mixed Martial Arts, Professional Wrestling and how he transformed from a terrorizing in ring combatant into a soft-spoken public speaker. 



         The first thing that I wanted to discuss was your membership in the UFC Hall of Fame.[ix] 

         “I am in, yes.”

         You have been vocal about your opinion on the status of the UFC now, and how the pay to the fighters has not exactly been reflective of the name recognition that of the company’s talent. 

         Currently, the UFC does not have a physical Hall of Fame in terms of an actual structure where fans can visit, similar to that of the Baseball Hall of Fame in Cooperstown, New York, the Hockey Hall of Fame in Toronto, Canada or the Pro Football Hall of Fame in Canton, Ohio.  Is this something that you hope will change in the near future?

“I get what your saying but I am not sure that the UFC Hall of Fame can get there.  The Halls of Fame that you spoke of have that kind of credibility is because those Halls have people that actually know the history.  In this case, we need someone who knows the history of Mixed Martial Arts.  The thing that we are missing today is the actual study and understanding where Mixed Martial Arts came from, how it got to where it is today, the people who helped create it.

Right now, the only Hall of Fame we have is with the knowledge of people who are from this era: not necessarily digging and trying to find out the roots of MMA, so we have people in the UFC Hall of Fame, who maybe friendly to the organization (UFC) or from just the memories of what we know. 

For instance, the UFC (Hall of Fame) does not have Frank Shamrock who was involved in their history, nor does it have Jerry Bolhander who was the very first person to hold any other belt than the open belts or the Heavyweight belt.[x]  Jerry Bolhander was the first one to capture those straps.[xi]  There’s no mention of him, and there has to be because it’s a first, even if may not have accomplished that much, it’s a first!

A lot of the history that we are seeing with this Halls of Fame (The UFC) basically have very limited knowledge with the people who are putting them into the Hall.  You get people over in Japan who fought with me in the Pancrase organization, with all of the people from around the world with Bas Rutten being one of them, who have definitely paved the road for what we know today as MMA, which started three years before the UFC was even born.[xii]

         For me, if there was a physical place for people to go and enjoy the Hall of Fame, you just can’t put up one like the Football Hall of Fame, or Baseball or Hockey or Golf because there hasn’t been enough study and enough education for people to enjoy it.  Nobody’s really doing their homework to get people interested as to where all of this came from; the people that made it important, the people that made it what it is today.

         To enjoy the people that get inducted today, you need to know that line that got us here.  How can you put something up when you don’t have the right information or even the right people to do this?  Every time someone is inducted (into the UFC Hall of Fame) it is always someone from the current era, but there’s no understanding where it came from.”

         Who would you like to see spearhead that?

         “Well, I would like to see the reporters who follow MMA have more of a role.[xiii]  On top of that I would like to see some historians who would do a legitimate background search on where this (Mixed Martial Arts) came from and how it all started because we know it goes all the way back to the Olympic Games.  It was hand-to-hand combat with two people with no skills or styles; just two people going in and one person would walk out.

         In all honesty, I would like to see induction done by those who know the history, those who know the stats, and those who know what they meant to the growth of UFC.  On the same level you also need a historian who could really make it legitimate of MMA, so that when people go to look at it, they are not just looking at what happened in the past twenty years. 

         Really, if you just look at that (time period), it is really quite boring, even though I know I was a part of that, and it was fun!  But don’t you think that when a person walks into a place like that (a MMA Hall of Fame) they could get a feel where the sport came from, so they can understand how we got where we are today?  It would make it a lot more interesting to see where people got to where they are at. 

         That’s my feeling.  We have to do a whole lot more studying on the history of MMA before we think about putting up a building and have people come and view it.”

         If this were to ever happen, would you want this to be independent from UFC?

         “I think you definitely need something that is separate.  When a Hall is controlled by one organization they can control who and who does the research.  You want people who are going to write what they think without fear of not being invited to the next ceremony.”

         Speaking of history, I personally feel that you did not receive the credit you deserve for bringing Mixed Martial Arts elements to the WWE.  With all due respect to Dan Severn who was there at the same time you were, he didn’t have the same impact you did.[xiv]  I will go on record that a match you had with the Undertaker on Pay Per View, was an underappreciated match where Taker was clearly showing he was influenced by what you had already done.[xv]  Do you think the WWE has put your influence on their product in proper perspective?

         “I don’t know if I can really speak to that.  I do feel that I definitely deserve to be in their Hall of Fame based on the things that I did while I was there, being able to change that sport along with other people.  I feel I earned that right based on what I was able to do there in a small amount of time.

         I’m not sure that I can stand here and boast about that.  The fans are the ones that really tell the tale and I think they speak very loudly about where I stand in pro wrestling.  I don’t think that there are too many people who would tell you that I don’t deserve to be there.

         Obviously, a lot of times the fans aren’t listened to, or their opinions are overlooked a lot.  Today’s promoters just push them aside and don’t listen to what they want and they want fans to ‘shut up, sit down and enjoy the show’, because we are going to do whatever we want to do, like it or not, because you are going to come to the show. 

         I hear it all the time in the WWE.  I hear about how fans would like to see certain wrestlers, and obviously you can’t give them everything they want, but you at least have to listen to them and I believe they are being completely ignored.  I’ve always said that I think the fans are most important that you have when it comes to the entertainment industry.  They are the ones that matter most and they should be heard.”

         In terms of your legacy, you have been billed as the “Godfather of MMA” and the “World’s Most Dangerous Man”, which is not exactly a title you think of when you think of a public speaker.  Yet, here you are in 2014, and have embarked into that field, and have done very well. 

         “The one thing that I want to mention so that it is understood.   When I was fighting, there was a station that came on that called me that.  They were looking at the World’s most dangerous food, or animal and of course, a person.[xvi]   At the time, I was the bare knuckle/no holds barred champion and they (the producers of the program) looked at me for that.  I was named the ‘World’s Most Dangerous Man’ through a show; I did not name myself that. It was given to me, and it stick with me.[xvii]

         ‘The Godfather of MMA’, it’s the same thing.  I never named myself that; people just started calling me that.  Once people start calling you that, especially if you’re a smart guy, you’re going to roll with what people say, or at least market it.  Therefore, I just carried the Godfather name, and I thought it was very respectful and I was honored to carry that.  I just want to make myself clear that I did not label myself that.  You can’t name yourself, that has to come from other people.”

         Understood. Again, though, your transformation from revered fighter to public speaker is very impressive.[xviii]  I would like to know, and pardon my language here, can you tell me about the switch from ‘bad-ass’, to an eloquent public speaker looking to inspire?

         “I was in trouble a lot as a kid. My biological mother was a go-go dancer at the time and wasn’t home a whole lot and therefore me and my brothers had to take care of ourselves.  We were in Georgia, and then we moved to California, and then later she (my biological mother) tried to have us live a constructive life with rules, but by that time it was too late it didn’t work out because we were already rebels at that time. 

         I ended up in all kinds of placements, and just a lot of anger and a lot of disappointment was in my life.  I ended up in a place called the Shamrock Boys Home and that’s where my life started changing around a little bit.[xix]  The man who ran it would become my father.  He showed me how to direct my anger in something positive, and that was through sports.  Some of them in the home would be directed through acting, or singing or whatever it might be but it allowed the kids to vent their frustrations through different activities.  Mine happened to be sports.

         I have always said that through MMA my life became something positive.  I was able to fight in Japan and release all that anger.  As life goes on, as you get older, you realize that you don’t need to feed off that anger anymore.  If you continue, it will eat you up inside.  You have to learn to forgive yourself and forgive other people in order to move forward in life, in order to raise a family, and to enjoy yourself. 

         I was able to do that by speaking to others about my life and explain to others that you don’t have to hang on to that hate anymore.  You’ve made it, and you’ve done the things you need to do and you don’t need to hit people or hate things and that guilt and anger that you’ve carried around for so long and let it go. 

         It was not easy for me to transition into learning how to fight and be that guy who did not stand on that anger.  It was very difficult but I ended up figuring it out, and once I did, I was able to go into motivational speaking.  I was able to go and speak to people in need to understand that it is ok what happened before, its ok to be angry about it, but you can’t hang on to those things because it will tear you apart later in life. 

         That’s where I am now.  I am writing a book about my life and I have been able to make the transition and I have been able to let things go and still be successful, that it where my speaking comes from.  You’d be surprised how many people are leading normal lives who have a lot of hurt or anger inside of them and they are still trying to figure out how to get rid of it”

         When people think of Ken Shamrock, they think of automatically think of your exploits in the UFC and WWE.  As a past star in both, is there anything you would change anything in either of those promotions?

         “I would.  In the WWE, I would push for them being to able have an outlet for the wrestlers for them to vent their frustrations, a personnel department where they could talk one on one and talk about what is going on in their lives.  There’s nothing there right now.  There are guys who are struggling in life and in certain situations and there is nowhere for them to turn.  That is what I would definitely implement there.

         For the UFC, the definite thing that I would improve there the most is the fighter pay.[xx]  Obviously they (the UFC) have their stance on it, but I would implement an opportunity for these guys to negotiate their terms and their ways to move forward in MMA.  There is definitely a personnel problem in those companies, there needs to place for guys to go and vent about on the job frustrations; a place where they go and speak their mind.

         Is there anything that you want fans of Ken Shamrock to know what you are up to?

         “I definitely do.  I have a website, www.kenshamrock.com, which has all my social media sites on there, Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, all of that.  I stay connected with my fans as much as I can, as they were the ones that really drove me to be successful.  I really wanted to make sure that when I was in the ring that they were entertained and was happy with what I was doing in the ring. 

         They really did help me to become successful, so I always like to stay connected to my fans, and I can do so through Social Media.  So go on Kenshamrock.com, and be a part of the family and you can see what am I doing, or what appearances and podcasts that I am doing, or book me for whatever event that you may be doing. 

         Also too, I do a lot of ministry work and with troubled youth and will always be available to speak to young people.  Other than that, you know, I’m just living life large and thank you so much for allowing me to speak to you.

         Thank you, for your time and supporting us at Notinhalloffame.com!

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[i]Ken last fought in 2010.

[ii]Ken has been outspoken in recent interviews about how the pay for the fighters have not been properly compensated for the increased revenue that UFC generates.

[iii]Inoki was inducted into the WWE Hall of Fame.

[iv]The Fujiwara name comes from Yoshiaki Fujiwara, the head of the promotion who was regarded highly for his shoot style of wrestling.

[v]‘Sports Entertainment’ is what Vince McMahon, the owner of the World Wrestling Federation referred to his company as.

[vi]Basically, the horrendous business practices of Don King caught up to the sport.

[vii]The lobbying was spearheaded by future Presidential candidate and then Senator, John McCain.

[viii]Shamrock would actually appear a month earlier as the special guest referee in the highly regarded Bret Hart/Steve Austin “I Quit Match” at Wrestlemania 13.

[ix]Along with Royce Gracie, Ken was the first inductee to the Hall.  It took place at UFC 45 on November 21, 2003.

[x]Bolhander, a member of Shamrock’s “Lion Den” won the UFC 12 Lightweight tournament.

[xi]In the early days of UFC, weight classes were essentially non-existent.

[xii]Pancrase, a Japanese promotion, was a precursor for the UFC.  Shamrock was the “First King of Pancrase Open Weight Champion”.  That occurred in 1993. 

[xiii]In the major North American sports Halls of Fame, media plays major roles in Hall of Fame inductions. 

[xiv]Severn may have had classic encounters with Shamrock and others in the octagon, but as a pro wrestler, Severn’s look and voice did not end himself to WWE success. 

[xv]That match took place at the Backlash Pay Per View on April 25, 1999.  Although it was not well received by some, the Undertaker would later adopt MMA moves into his repertoire.  Frankly, I loved that match, and enjoyed it for being different than anything else that had been on WWE TV in some time. 

[xvi]The station was ABC, and was done on ABC News. 

[xvii]When Ken worked in the WWF, they billed him as such, though initially crediting ABC for that moniker.  

[xviii]An example of Ken’s public speaking can be found here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8coM29QvSSY

[xix]It was run by Bob Shamrock, who would have over 600 boys during his time running the Home.  Ken, whose birth name was Ken Kilpatrick, would later be adopted by Bob, and take on the Shamrock family name as his own. 

[xx]Ken has been a longtime advocate for this for sometime and has been very blunt on this topic on numerous interviews.

Two months ago we were able to have a conversation with Mike Litherland, who runs the “Induct Janet Jackson to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame” campaign that is gaining a sizable following on both Facebook and Twitter. We knew then that we wanted to continue interviewing heads of Hall of Fame campaigns and turn it into a regular series here at Notinhalloffame.com. With that in mind we turned our attention to Washington D.C., specifically towards the most powerful Offensive Lines in the history of Professional Football.

In the National Football League, the press generally goes to the skill positions, ie, the Quarterback, the Running Back and the Wide Receiver. Usually when the camera focuses on an Offensive Linemen, it is for a costly holding penalty. Linemen are respected, but never the stars; but that changed in the 1980’s coverage of the Washington Redskins games with the emergence of the “Hogs”.

Originally consisting of Russ Grimm, Joe Jacoby, Jeff Bostic, Mark May and George Starke, the nickname was generated not because of their large size but due to an innocuous comment by Joe Bugel, the Offensive Line Coach who told his line, “Okay, you hogs, let’s get running down there.”.

That one sentence was all it took and a phenomenon was born. The sophisticated Washington fan base latched onto this group and quickly realized that had more than just a tag line that John Madden extolled the virtues of on Sunday afternoons. This was a formidable group that made stars out of average football players, and did it over and over again. It also made a group of football fans celebrities, too.

Calling themselves “The Hogettes”, a group of a dozen men dressed up in pig snouts and dresses that would be worn old women and for many was as entertaining as the game itself. Appearing in the stands for Redskins home games for three decades, the Hogettes may have hung up their snouts, but there is one more task left to perform; helping their former great tackle, Joe Jacoby, receive a bust in Canton, Ohio.

We had a chance to speak with the Hogettes, who are pushingto add a second member from their beloved Offensive Line into the Professional Football Hall of Fame. As someone who watched the Redskins intensely for years and who has a relationship with Joe Jacoby himself, the Hogettes bring a unique perspective to this discussion and whenever we have a chance to chat with passionate football fans, it is a job we will always sign up for.



The first thing that I want to get into before we really get started, is that in doing my research for this piece, I was pleasantly surprised to learn that the Hogettes did so many charitable endeavors. I had no idea about it! I think that is incredible and I wanted to first commend you for it.

“Thanks, we appreciate that. That is something that not everyone knows about. We were more than just a bunch of crazy football fans, though it kind of morphed into that.”

And this has continued even though you don’t “perform” in the stands anymore?

“Yes. A lot of the guys still participate in it (charity work), and we still get invited often. We turn down any formal requests to get dressed up, since we are retired, but we are finding that we are still asked to come out.[i] We were just out at Mark Rypien’s golf benefit and a lot of the fundraisers we have done in the past.”

Your current push, and I notice that this is a focal point of your official website, is to get Joe Jacoby inducted into the Pro Football Hall of Fame. His line mate, Russ Grimm, was enshrined some time ago.[ii] Jacoby has received a lot of respect throughout the league, and from Grimm himself who stated that he should be there.[iii]

I am sure you are asked often why Joe should be in the Hall of Fame. Do you have a quick sum up that you usually go to, or a set of intangibles that you go to that explains why he should be in the Hall of Fame?

“What I kind of go to is when you look at the Redskins as one of the great teams of the 80’s when Joe Gibbs was coaching, Joe (Jacoby) played Left Tackle, the glamour spot of the Offensive Line. When you think about the Washington Redskins (of that time period) you think of that Offensive Line.

There are great lines out there, but there are only a few that were so great that they transcend time. The ones that come to mind are (1970’s) Oakland[iv], Pittsburgh back in the day[v], and the Houston Oilers (in the 80’s)[vi], they have had two Linemen enter to Pro Football Hall of Fame, and rightfully so, but the Hogs are right there with them.

We could argue all day about who was the best (Offensive) Line of all time, and of course we’re partial to the Hogs, but what really sets them apart is that they went to four Super Bowls, won three with three different Quarterbacks and three different Running Backs.[vii] To me that speaks volumes about what was the one constant on all of those Super Bowl teams, and that was that Offensive Line.[viii] Jacoby was the anchor of that line and Jacoby held it down during the glory years.

I just feel that this line was so good, and no matter who you talk to, they will tell you that they were in the top five of all time and they should have two players inducted.[ix] Russ got in in 2010 and there should be another. Sometimes when one member of a line gets in they feel that the entire group has been honored. We feel that this line was so good that they deserve two.”

Why do you think so far that he has not gotten in? Thus far he has only made it to the Semi-Finalist Round. Do you think it is a political thing, or due to the glut of talent eligible or is there another factor that maybe we are not thinking of?

“I think a combination of a lot of it. It is very political. Like I said, because Russ is in, they can say that they recognized that. The other thing I think that really plays itself is in the last decade you have seen the NFL push the rules towards the offense and you see offensive (skill players) put up really big numbers. You are seeing some phenomenal numbers from Receivers and Running Backs and of course some advances (statistically) in the Passing Game. Indirectly that takes some of the shine off the Left Tackles and other Offensive Linemen.

There are some players in recent memory, like for example going back to Walter Jones who got in last year.[x] You can make a great argument that Joe should have gone in before him. I’m not taking anything away from Jones. He was a great player, he went to one Super Bowl, didn’t win any. Jacoby was the premier Left Tackle on the great line, and that line again transcends having more than one man (inducted).

Going back to the Redskins, they have only one retired number, that of Sammy Baugh.[xi] Saying that the organization has a tradition of “unofficially” retiring number, Joe Theismann being one of them.[xii] I don’t believe they have given that honor to either Grimm or Jacoby.

“I’ve seen 66 or 68 worn since.”[xiii]

Would that be something that you would push for in the future?

“The Redskins don’t have a history of retiring numbers for whatever reason. They do have a history of not giving them out. That is how the Redskins have chosen to handle that. Other teams have certainly done that (retired numbers frequently).”

What kind of relationship does this movement have with Joe Jacoby himself?

“We wanted to make sure Joe was O.K. with it. Joe did not ask us and he is one of the most modest guys you will ever meet. He has no plans in politicking for himself, like Harry Carson did.[xiv] Joe has no desire to do that. Joe is coaching the Offensive Line foe Concordia University, and he is happy doing that. He is a humble guy, extremely grateful that we decided to do this.

When we were at Mark Rypien’s golf tournament, and we told him what we were thinking. Mikey T, the head of the Hogettes has been talking about this for the last few years and as we were approaching retiring (The Hogettes), we discussed how Joe is the one guy we really needed to help get into the Hall. We wanted that to be our swan song. Anything we can do to keep his name on the forefront; that is our goal.”

There is still a lot of time.

“There is. He retired in ’93 and still has another nine years before he has to go the Senior route.”[xv]

Having said that, the Senior route is what got Ray Guy finally inducted.[xvi]

“Yeah, I’m not saying that this would be the worst thing, but you’re talking about another nine years. I’m pretty objective when it comes to this, I know I am a homer in regards to the Redskins, but I just feel their Offensive Line was too good to ignore. When you look at the Cowboys and the Niners they had a great supporting cast, they had Montana. Who did we have? We had Theismann, Rypien and Williams. It was always a different cast of characters around that O-Line.”

They certainly made Joe Theismann a star, and as much as he remains a public figure and well known to the next generation of Football fans, nobody is pushing for Joe Theismann to be in the Hall of Fame.

“Right, and no one is pushing for Mark Rypien or Doug Williams either. Riggins got in, which is good, but it was the O-Line that made those teams go.”

Do you think that the Hall of Fame committee puts too much premium on Pro Bowl selections? Jacoby only had four, but perhaps they don’t look at the bigger picture?

“I think that can happen, especially lately. The good side is that I am a firm believer that you don’t have to have won a bunch of Super Bowls to be a Hall of Famer. I look at the Buffalo Bills who went to four Super Bowls and didn’t win, but they are still one of the best teams I have ever seen. I think some times they can put too much weight on that as well. I could see that being a little too much weighted but I can see that those who don’t have Super Bowl rings being penalized, where Joe has three. I don’t worry about that argument a whole lot. I think it was thirteen different Running Backs that at least had one 100-yard game with that Line, which is pretty phenomenal.

If Jacoby becomes a Finalist, generally they don’t revert back to being just a Semi-Finalist. It would be huge for him just to make that leap, even if he does not make it to the Hall this year.

“Yes, he made it to the Semis. If we can get him to that last group, then maybe we can get that one last step. Russ (Grimm) was great some believe that Joe should have gone in before him. Still, both of them should be in.

Thank you so much for your time!

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[i] The Hogettes officially retired in 2013.
[ii] Grimm was inducted in 2010, after being a Finalist the five years previously.
[iii] Grimm has said this on many occasions to many media outlets.
[iv] They produced four Hall of Fame inductees, Art Shell, Bob Brown, Gene Upshaw and Jim Otto.
[v] That team was anchored by Center, Mike Webster.
[vi] Mike Munchak and Bruce Matthews entered the Pro Football Hall of Fame from that roster.
[vii] Joe Theismann and John Riggins in Super Bowl XVII, Doug Williams and Timmy Smith in Super Bowl in XXII and Mark Rypien and Earnest Byner in Super Bowl XXVI.
[viii] Of those six above players, only Riggins is in the Hall of Fame. The other five have never been considered for Canton.
[ix] This is a logical argument. Even diehard fans of the Dallas Cowboys would have a hard time disputing that.
[x] Jones entered the Pro Football Hall of Fame in 2014, his first year of eligibility.
[xi] Baugh was the Redskins Quarterback from 1937 to 1952 and was a member of the first Pro Football Hall of Fame Class in 1963.
[xii] The other former Redskins who have had their number “unofficially retired” are Sonny Jurgensen, Darrell Green, Charley Taylor, Larry Brown, John Riggins, Bobby Mitchell, Dave Butz, Sam Huff and Art Monk.
[xiii] These were numbers worn by Grimm and Jacoby respectively.
[xiv] Carson was inducted in 2006. He was very vocal about being snubbed for years to the point where in 2004 he asked for his name to be removed from the ballot.
[xv] Annually the Pro Football Hall of Fame announces one or two candidates from the Senior Committee. They automatically earn a spot into the Finalist round.
[xvi] Guy entered in 2014, his first year on the Senior Ballot. He was a multi time Finalist in the past.

As you can imagine from the name of our website, and the content that we create, the origins of Hall of Fames and the thought process behind it is fascinating to us, and myself in particular as the owner of this site. I think it is a safe assumption to say that we know why they are created: out of the need for us to celebrate the absolute elite in any profession. Recognizing that, each Hall of Fame has their own vision, though for the Las Vegas based Boxing Hall of Fame owned and operated by Steve Lott, it was a vision decades in the making.

Speaking with Steve was like sitting under the learning tree of the sweet science. A historian of the sport and disciple of Jim Jacobs, Steve spoke to me about the long struggle to use their vast Boxing film library and create a Hall of Fame that celebrated just the fighters, and not the ones behind the scenes.

Opening as part of Score, a sport themed attraction at the Luxor Hotel in the Las Vegas Strip in 2012, Steve Lott has created just that, a vibrant exhibit utilizing the historical and priceless film archive and embracing the modern social media to push his product. This differentiates this Hall of Fame from all of the other Boxing related Halls and uses every square inch they are given in Boxing’s prime real estate.

We spoke about the long path to the creation of his Boxing Hall of Fame, his personal relationship with former Heavyweight Champion, Mike Tyson, and the state of Boxing itself and how he views its past, present and future.